.............................Daily Mail



ROCKMAN

don't forget the other support band Black Uhuru, they were great........stuck in the middle of the crowd it was also my first experience of having to weewee in an empty lemonade bottle

I saw them on the 26th June. A bad gig - as was the 25th by the sound of it. On 26th you could see Jagger just lost interest. Totally going through the motions.

The J Geils band were much better. And Black Uhuru for that matter!

Barney Hoskins was right.

As Doxa's clips show - the band was a bit of a mess - and Mick especially. They couldn't really give a ****. Mick especially.

No wonder he wanted a break from the circus act and the mess that Keith and Ronnie were at the time.

I have friends who thought that Leeds was good, though.

You have friends?

...another great picture from the first Wembley show courtesy of Philip Kamin:

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LOGIE
...another great picture from the first Wembley show courtesy of Philip Kamin:

Going by the red shirt that would more probably be the 2nd Wembley show.

Yes indeed!

I stand corrected!

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LOGIE
You have friends?

I have to detail them for you? OK

My friends, Adam, Bob, Vicky and Bruce all enjoyed the finale at Roundhay Park. Plus another couple of friends I got to know later. One was Colin. He was on acid at Roundhay. So he doesn't count!

Sorry to spoil your party, Logie, but as I've mentioned to you before, this Wembley gig was the lowest low point in my Stones-watching life. Worse than '76. In '76 they had some sort of excuse in a a junked out Keith, and Mick popping pills every three minutes. In '82 Keith was relatively clean and (as witness She's so Cold) he was completely 'out to lunch'. Mick could hardly be bothered to sing.

Wembley 1990 was a far more exultant affair, with totally engaged Mick and Keith back in furious flow. The demeanour and presence of the 1990 Keith is more convincing on just about every level than the one pictured above.

But I enjoyed reading Hoskins' review again. Perhaps he saw the Saturday gig, as I did. Perhaps your Friday gig was that much better? My friend Nick and his girlfriend certainly enjoyed it

Here are some of my pics from the first Cologne show ( 4-7-1982 ).
It was my first Stones show ever and it was pure excitement and great fun.

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Four Stone Walls

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LOGIE
You have friends?

I have to detail them for you? OK

My friends, Adam, Bob, Vicky and Bruce all enjoyed the finale at Roundhay Park. Plus another couple of friends I got to know later. One was Colin. He was on acid at Roundhay. So he doesn't count!

Sorry to spoil your party, Logie, but as I've mentioned to you before, this Wembley gig was the lowest low point in my Stones-watching life. Worse than '76. In '76 they had some sort of excuse in a a junked out Keith, and Mick popping pills every three minutes. In '82 Keith was relatively clean and (as witness She's so Cold) he was completely 'out to lunch'. Mick could hardly be bothered to sing.

Wembley 1990 was a far more exultant affair, with totally engaged Mick and Keith back in furious flow. The demeanour and presence of the 1990 Keith is more convincing on just about every level than the one pictured above.

But I enjoyed reading Hoskins' review again. Perhaps he saw the Saturday gig, as I did. Perhaps your Friday gig was that much better? My friend Nick and his girlfriend certainly enjoyed it

Having attended the Leeds gig myself, and found it to be hugely disappointing by comparison to the first Wembley show, it perhaps places into persepective just how much more your friends would have enjoyed the London opener. In fact they'd have been knocked out, as was myself and (seemingly) tens of thousands of others, including several on this board.

On the other hand, if, like yourself, your pals regard clips from youtube as their sole guiding light to what's good and bad in this world, then God help them.

...and God help yourself (and anyone else) who may feel that sheer, unadulterated raunch is obviously not their thing.

Still, at least Barney Hopkins had an agenda to fulfil (from his editor).

What were you doing there?

...obviously not partying!

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Doxa
Sorry, I need to keep these coming. I can't resist. Anyone who think the soft-porn version of "Jumping Jack" in ABB is worth of any praise, should take a look at this... in the end of the song, there is a long pause while teh people cry for an encore. Anyone here spotted in the audience?



- Doxa

LOL How is the ABB version of JJ flash soft porn?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-01-09 06:13 by ryanpow.

Really nice thread going here...! Interesting read

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Britney

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Orbit

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Britney
Has the "Make The World Go Round" vinyl boot ever made to a CD-R transfer? I recall some moons ago Silkcut announced an attempt but as far as I know it has never seen the light of day...

Yeah the playin was sloppy at times but they sure rocked.

Britney - I have transferred my vinyl to CD-R. Let me know if you would like a copy.

Thanx I would love a copy! Maybe it's best to post it here or one of the trackers so all the Wembley 82 fanatics can relive the moment?

Er, that's a bit beyond my PC capabilities I'm afraid. However I'm more than happy to provide a CD-R snail mail to someone who will post it.

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LOGIE

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Four Stone Walls

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LOGIE
You have friends?

I have to detail them for you? OK

My friends, Adam, Bob, Vicky and Bruce all enjoyed the finale at Roundhay Park. Plus another couple of friends I got to know later. One was Colin. He was on acid at Roundhay. So he doesn't count!

Sorry to spoil your party, Logie, but as I've mentioned to you before, this Wembley gig was the lowest low point in my Stones-watching life. Worse than '76. In '76 they had some sort of excuse in a a junked out Keith, and Mick popping pills every three minutes. In '82 Keith was relatively clean and (as witness She's so Cold) he was completely 'out to lunch'. Mick could hardly be bothered to sing.

Wembley 1990 was a far more exultant affair, with totally engaged Mick and Keith back in furious flow. The demeanour and presence of the 1990 Keith is more convincing on just about every level than the one pictured above.

But I enjoyed reading Hoskins' review again. Perhaps he saw the Saturday gig, as I did. Perhaps your Friday gig was that much better? My friend Nick and his girlfriend certainly enjoyed it

Having attended the Leeds gig myself, and found it to be hugely disappointing by comparison to the first Wembley show, it perhaps places into persepective just how much more your friends would have enjoyed the London opener. In fact they'd have been knocked out, as was myself and (seemingly) tens of thousands of others, including several on this board.

On the other hand, if, like yourself, your pals regard clips from youtube as their sole guiding light to what's good and bad in this world, then God help them.

...and God help yourself (and anyone else) who may feel that sheer, unadulterated raunch is obviously not their thing.

Still, at least Barney Hopkins had an agenda to fulfil (from his editor).

What were you doing there?

...obviously not partying!

I went to four shows in 82 and would rate them in the following order:

1) Wembley 25/6/82 BRILLIANT my first Stones show (see above) - From what I could see I thought the band really seemed up for it.
2) Cologne 5/7/82 - performance ok, it was just really exciting as an 18 year old back then to see a concert overseas (inclusive coach trip including travel, one night hotel stay and concet ticket was just £65 - these days would hardly buy you a concert ticket!)
3) Leeds 25/7/82 - lovely day, great occasion and they played "Angie" - wow! set list variation.
4) Wembley 26/6/82 - sloppy performance and I was knackered from the day before. In fairness, if this had been my only '82 show, I wouldn' have been disappointed.

Dear Logie,

"sheer, unadulterated raunch" ? Yes, well many classless garage bands have that in abundance - and some can play better and with more passion and commitment. A lot of punk bands, for example.

God Help Me for not going just to experience "sheer unadulterated raunch"?

I had hugely enjoyed "Still life". It boded well. Guitars engaged and the band more or less on all four cylinders. So I had high expectations. What was I doing there? Hoping to experience a great show along those lines from my favourite R&R band. Much as yourself, I expect.

What I witnessed on the Saturday was a shabby band with a singer who soon lost interest. I remember distinctly the offhand way he threw lines away, especially the "Oh baby, that's what I like" from Chantilly Lace. I attended the gig with other Stones fans who were all non-plussed. (Their names are: Jem, Kim,
and Nicky). Havn't seen them in ages. Kim and Nicky are now in Australia. Jem lives in Poland where he organises rock tours, including, in 1996, Mick Taylor.

btw i didn't believe Roundhay Park was a good gig just because some friends said so. I think they all enjoyed the "event" - as many enjoyed Knebworth, when also, the Stones were below par.

I think the Youtube clips (the couple I've clicked on) do clearly show that the band was a mess.

I don't find it difficult to believe that the Friday night show was better than the Saturday.

I think the 1982 tour was much less consistent than the 1981 tour. I found it interesting on another recent thread that Mick (and Ronnie?) didn't really want to do it. I think it's generally agreed that he was totally fed up with Keith and Ronnie by the end of that tour.

By 1990 they were playing as a tight and committed unit again. Nick Kent's criticism of that tour (on a "J'Accuse" program - BBC2?) was unfair. He was using criticisms that were applicable to 1982 Tour - Jagger's generally arrogant, disinterested attitude to the audience, for example.

I also don't agree with you that the Stones were somehow regaining their crown after punk and new-wave had 'gone'. There were more interesting things happening musically at the time. And The Clash had not died. They were at the top of their 'game' - they were th real rock MacCoy in 1982.

I happened to like a lot of the early eighties synth bands. A freshness and originality. Spandau. Depeche Mode. Human League. Never seen them or bought a record - but an interesting time musically nevertheless. Tears For Fears.

God Help Me? Well not all music is about "sheer, unadulterated raunch", is it?
I trust not. I believe not. (Not implying that you do either). But it wasn't a question of Stones having some genuine relevance in comparison to the rest of the musical scene - (I think Hoskins is right there) - any more than it was in in 1989/1990, when there was a lot of good, current music (more guitar-based again at that time).

Look forward to discussing this again in person.

Friend in the North

A couple of pictures I took on the second Wembley date, sadly not great quality.....

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Four Stone Walls
Dear Logie,

"sheer, unadulterated raunch" ? Yes, well many classless garage bands have that in abundance - and some can play better and with more passion and commitment. A lot of punk bands, for example.

God Help Me for not going just to experience "sheer unadulterated raunch"?

I had hugely enjoyed "Still life". It boded well. Guitars engaged and the band more or less on all four cylinders. So I had high expectations. What was I doing there? Hoping to experience a great show along those lines from my favourite R&R band. Much as yourself, I expect.

What I witnessed on the Saturday was a shabby band with a singer who soon lost interest. I remember distinctly the offhand way he threw lines away, especially the "Oh baby, that's what I like" from Chantilly Lace. I attended the gig with other Stones fans who were all non-plussed. (Their names are: Jem, Kim,
and Nicky). Havn't seen them in ages. Kim and Nicky are now in Australia. Jem lives in Poland where he organises rock tours, including, in 1996, Mick Taylor.

btw i didn't believe Roundhay Park was a good gig just because some friends said so. I think they all enjoyed the "event" - as many enjoyed Knebworth, when also, the Stones were below par.

I think the Youtube clips (the couple I've clicked on) do clearly show that the band was a mess.

I don't find it difficult to believe that the Friday night show was better than the Saturday.

I think the 1982 tour was much less consistent than the 1981 tour. I found it interesting on another recent thread that Mick (and Ronnie?) didn't really want to do it. I think it's generally agreed that he was totally fed up with Keith and Ronnie by the end of that tour.

By 1990 they were playing as a tight and committed unit again. Nick Kent's criticism of that tour (on a "J'Accuse" program - BBC2?) was unfair. He was using criticisms that were applicable to 1982 Tour - Jagger's generally arrogant, disinterested attitude to the audience, for example.

I also don't agree with you that the Stones were somehow regaining their crown after punk and new-wave had 'gone'. There were more interesting things happening musically at the time. And The Clash had not died. They were at the top of their 'game' - they were th real rock MacCoy in 1982.

I happened to like a lot of the early eighties synth bands. A freshness and originality. Spandau. Depeche Mode. Human League. Never seen them or bought a record - but an interesting time musically nevertheless. Tears For Fears.

God Help Me? Well not all music is about "sheer, unadulterated raunch", is it?
I trust not. I believe not. (Not implying that you do either). But it wasn't a question of Stones having some genuine relevance in comparison to the rest of the musical scene - (I think Hoskins is right there) - any more than it was in in 1989/1990, when there was a lot of good, current music (more guitar-based again at that time).

Look forward to discussing this again in person.

Friend in the North

Take a good look at the crowd scenes from 5.53 onwards in the Jumpin' Jack Flash clip earlier in this thread. See how young, fresh-faced and energetic they all seem. All of them there, simply to live for the moment and have a great time; to try and get out of themselves, even for just a couple of hours; perhaps even to forget about unemployment and the all the other problems that were besetting Thatcher’s Britain at the beginning of the eighties. For those kids, life was NOT a rehearsal; nor was it something to be pondered over and reflected upon many years into the future.

Can you can spot yourself among the rain-soaked hoards of kids down towards the front?

Probably not.

Because you were already a fifty year-old back in 1982, sitting up in the stands trying to gauge how much “enjoyment” that the gig was providing for yourself and your buddies; concerning yourself about how much Keef was putting into the show without probably putting anything back yourself.

Did you even manage to muster the odd clap or cheer; a roar perhaps; or even offer a smile in the direction of the proceedings, or were you too concerned as to whether the band were hitting all the right notes?

Never, in a million years, could you even begin to understand the principles of the live-for-the-moment-crank-it-up-and-bash-it-out sound that was so perfectly apt for the time, and for which those kids (including myself) will forever remember that gig by. You'd rather wait twenty-odd years, and then make ludicrous comparisons with tours that happened eight years into the future.

Empathising with those who simply want to have a great time was (and no doubt still is) beyond your comprehension.

Instead you seem more at ease with the fictional alien being (from another planet) on whose behalf Barney Hoskins wrote his report.

At least in that character, you’ve finally found your very own soul mate.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-01-09 20:04 by LOGIE.

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Orbit

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Britney

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Orbit

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Britney
Has the "Make The World Go Round" vinyl boot ever made to a CD-R transfer? I recall some moons ago Silkcut announced an attempt but as far as I know it has never seen the light of day...

Yeah the playin was sloppy at times but they sure rocked.

Britney - I have transferred my vinyl to CD-R. Let me know if you would like a copy.

Thanx I would love a copy! Maybe it's best to post it here or one of the trackers so all the Wembley 82 fanatics can relive the moment?

Er, that's a bit beyond my PC capabilities I'm afraid. However I'm more than happy to provide a CD-R snail mail to someone who will post it.

Anyone up for the job? Putting up a torrent still isn't my forte. I can post the odd track with yousendit but that seems like a bit of a hassle for everyone when posting/downloading a complete show...

Dear Logie,

You write

"Because you were already a fifty year-old back in 1982, sitting up in the stands trying to gauge how much “enjoyment” that the gig was providing for yourself and your buddies; concerning yourself about how much Keef was putting into the show without probably putting anything back yourself.

Did you even manage to muster the odd clap or cheer; a roar perhaps; or even offer a smile in the direction of the proceedings, or were you too concerned as to whether the band were hitting all the right notes?

Never, in a million years, could you even begin to understand the principles of the live-for-the-moment-crank-it-up-and-bash-it-out sound that was so perfectly apt for the time, and for which those kids (including myself) will forever remember that gig by. You'd rather wait twenty-odd years, and then make ludicrous comparisons with tours that happened eight years into the future.

Empathising with those who simply want to have a great time was (and no doubt still is) beyond your comprehension.

Instead you seem more at ease with the fictional alien being (from another planet) on whose behalf Barney Hoskins wrote his report.

At least in that character, you’ve finally found your very own soul mate."

No, I was not 50 years old, and even though I am now, I can still really get carried away by the moment if the groove is good and the spirit genuine. I was not sitting up in the stands. I was standing quarter way back and none of the fans around me looked very animated either, after the initial stage appearance.
Logie, we were at different gigs and in different audience sections. i trust your observations.

Yes, i mustered the odd clap and cheer. It wasn't a question of hitting the right notes - it was a feeling that they didn't care. Not good enough. I cared.

I love the principles of crank it up and bash it out - but preferably with passion, commitment and competence. i loved punk. but not many punk bands could mess up an intro like the one to She's So Cold above - Keith does it these days rather frequently - but we forgive him - cos of age and arthritis.



Ofcourse I can empathise with those that want to have a good time. That's why we go, isn't it? But one can be disappointed - feel let down - can't one - and find that one is not having a good time. The fools are the ones that convince themselves that they are having a good time just because they are at Stones gig. I am sure there are those here that have been to a Stones gig which was poor/sub-standard and have left disappointed.

Perhaps if I'd been to the Friday gig I might have had your no-holds-barred enthusiasm. Perhaps if you'd been to the Saturday gig you'd have shared my disillusionment. Both fair and genuine reactions from genuine fans.

I'm at ease with a fictional alien being and its my soul mate??!!!!!

I think Barney Hoskins wrote a personal report. I can appreciate his angle after the gig I saw. He was attempting some sureal objectivity. And there were other good bands around that did not involve a huge trek to some massive arena of worship. If the band's good, then fine, but if not, then how empty and hollow the experience.

I will repeat:

I went to the gig with great anticipation and expectation - based on Still Life and on a personal report from someone who saw the Newcastle gig. I was not wearing an intellectual's cap that day. Good company. Good crowd. Good warm-up acts. Then the Stones. And what I heard and saw burst my bubble. It is that simple.

I've only clicked on a couple of the clips above and assumed them to be the Friday gig. If so, they confirmed mine and Barnie's observations/feelings. I'll click on a few more maybe.

NB 'Orbit' above was knocked out by the Friday gig but not impressed by the Saturday one.

NB I don't think there was a duff 1973 Wembley Arena gig, or a duff 1990 Wembley Stadium gig. many of my friends cited above thought the latter fantastic. I danced from start to finish at both, (and 1973, needless to say). Rough raunch did not enter the equation. It didn't need to.

To be continued offline sometime, perhaps.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-01-09 23:12 by Four Stone Walls.

As much as I enjoyed Wembley and Leeds 82, the second and third shows at Wembley 1990 were better.

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The GR
As much as I enjoyed Wembley and Leeds 82, the second and third shows at Wembley 1990 were better.

I loved the Wembley 1990 shows. Went to the lot and they were storming. I didn't realise that they would set the pace for the rest of their live career to date and that 1982 was the last (and only) time I'd see The Stones as they originally were, so to speak.

Mind you, I'd seen The Who's 1989 run at Wembley Arena the year before (when they basically had a similar set up to The Stones - extra musicians galore, backing vocalists) and thought it was way too slick. They're much better as a quintet. Maybe the Stones ought to try that again in 2010.

This is not my favourite tour. I think the Stones played much better in the nineties! Tokyo 90, Bremen 98 or the wonderful London club show 95 are so much more impressive than these clips here!

Has been posted here on IORR somewhere already but I think fits pefectly in this great thread.

Newcastle - Time is on my side

As well as these two from Rotterdam

Going to a Go-Go





Tumbling Dice

There is one odd thing about the 1982 tour- that was the tour I was following as a kid - even though not entering on any shows because it was too much asked for a teenager to travel to another country to see a band that still had quite a bad boy reputation, and taking the nature and habits of the crowds at the time ... But it was all over the media (of course, the media of the day); in almost every Finnish newspaper and magazine was a sort of reportage of the Ullevi or other shows, I think the whole 1981/82 was a huge triumph for the band - it was the first 'huge' stadium tour, and I think the band was more popular than ever (the interest outside the hardcore fanbase towards the band was perhaps biggest, at least). After the punk, new wave,just before the big heavy rock movement, they were like bringing the point back home, reminding of the 'original' nature of rock and roll, and I think they had a great image among the youngsters, including me, They felt almost immortal, 8th wonder of the world, and untouchable by any snobbish critics like that NME guy.

But odd thing has been recognizing that the band - even though it looked perhaps stronger than ever to outside - had a really hard time. Looking Wyman's account of it is ROLLING WITH THE STONES makes it almost a 'lost' tour. Not much good memories - their reherseals were merely bad ones, band out of direction, personal relationship worse than ever, a lot ot of fighting between Mick and Keith, Ronnie deep in dope, etc. Jagger seemed to be really fed up with Keith and Ron - and wasn't interest at all to make the european leg - and after that there wouldn't a tour for seven years.

But at the time there was no sign at all of their 'inner' problems. So that was news to me afterwards to learn of how bad memories they had of that triumphal tour.

Just an observation.

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-01-10 17:09 by Doxa.

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shortfatfanny
Has been posted here on IORR somewhere already but I think fits pefectly in this great thread.

Newcastle - Time is on my side

Great clip!

It's first airing was on Channel 4's The Tube programme on Friday, 10th December 1982.

...and here's a ticket stub:

Memories of a great weekend of rock and roll....

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Doxa
There is one odd thing about the 1982 tour- that was the tour I was following as a kid - even though not entering on any shows because it was too much asked for a teenager to travel to another country to see a band that still had quite a bad boy reputation, and taking the nature and habits of the crowds at the time ... But it was all over the media (of course, the media of the day); in almost every Finnish newspaper and magazine was a sort of reportage of the Ullevi or other shows, I think the whole 1981/82 was a huge triumph for the band - it was the first 'huge' stadium tour, and I think the band was more popular than ever (the interest outside the hardcore fanbase towards the band was perhaps biggest, at least). After the punk, new wave,just before the big heavy rock movement, they were like bringing the point back home, reminding of the 'original' nature of rock and roll, and I think they had a great image among the youngsters, including me, They felt almost immortal, 8th wonder of the world, and untouchable by any snobbish critics like that NME guy.

But odd thing has been recognizing that the band - even though it looked perhaps stronger than ever to outside - had a really hard time. Looking Wyman's account of it is ROLLING WITH THE STONES makes it almost a 'lost' tour. Not much good memories - their reherseals were merely bad ones, band out of direction, personal relationship worse than ever, a lot ot of fighting between Mick and Keith, Ronnie deep in dope, etc. Jagger seemed to be really fed up with Keith and Ron - and wasn't interest at all to make the european leg - and after that there wouldn't a tour for seven years.

But at the time there was no sign at all of their 'inner' problems. So that was news to me afterwards to learn of how bad memories they had of that triumphal tour.

Just an observation.

- Doxa

As mentioned in another thread recently, the Stones had actually become very close to ditching the idea of a european tour altogether, perhaps with the intention of waiting for the dust to settle in the aftermath of the punk explosion. Pete Townshend did pecisely this as early as 1977, by aiming the Who Are You album directly at the american market, and though never openly admitting to it, Jagger might well have had this in mind with Some Girls.

In his 1980 interview with Paul Morley of NME, Jagger was very much aware of the exaggerated influence that the british music press still commanded, pointing out that the situation was totally different in america. Though concerned enough not to dismiss it out of hand, he was also quick to describe it as as a pre-orchestrated "cycle" that would eventually burn itself out because nothing seemed to be coming through.

Of particular note however, was his largely philosophical tone, which offered very broad hints as to the next phase of the Rolling Stones; almost as if he had actually taken on board a great deal of the punk ethos, and was more than happy to go out there and beat them at their own game. "These new kids might have lots of energy, but energy alone, isn't enough", was his main thrust.

Perhaps Jagger was right all along, because, by 1982, the cycle HAD burned itself out, leaving a european public with an unexpectedly huge appetite for some good old back-to-basics rock n' roll music.

The Stones' collective hearts might not have been in it, but they duly obliged.

If I remember right, Jagger said the expression "thats a load of old bollocks" about ten times in that NME interview.

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LOGIE
Pete Townshend did pecisely this as early as 1977, by aiming the Who Are You album directly at the american market, and though never openly admitting to it, Jagger might well have had this in mind with Some Girls.

how exactly would they have done this (aim an album specifically at the US market)?

"Sister Disco"?