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liddas

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T&A
liddas: i don't understand your point about the bootleg market. can you expand on that?

Not much to add!

As far as a recording (live / outtake) remains non published, it is basically up to the Stones to decide if react or not against unauthorized circulation of boots. As a matter of fact the stones have always tolerated bootlegs. And I am thankful for this. Just consider the huge amount of stuff that's now available. For free. Now just think if this stuff was published. Always available, but you would have to pay! And I am quite sure that Univresal's lawyers don't share the same attitude that the stones have towards bootlegs ...

C

ok - well, i don't think their attitude has much to do with the viability of the bootleg market, frankly. and, there's been a very noticeable change in the number of "leaks" of boards the past decade or so - that might be a better indicator of how "tolerant" the lads are, actually....

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Gazza

1) Not all unreleased material circulates on bootlegs. Only a fraction of it does. In the era of downloading, they could easily make the individual bonus tracks available on i-tunes anyway.


2) 90 or 100 Euros is not the average for a Stones concert in the UK. Its considerably more. (its also considerably more in the UK than elsewhere in Europe because they insist we buy seated tickets, but thats another discussion)

Its also considerably more than the average for a concert ticket by almost anyone in the UK, regardless of whether theyre a new act or an established one. Believe me, I've looked at them and I've bought plenty as well.

You cant compare merchandise for football, because its a different market and different audience. The barometer is concert tickets with other acts. And football is only really extremely pricey if you're following the Premiership. Maybe theres a comparison after all - I'd imagine that, like the Stones, Chelsea's demographic has changed significantly in the last few years.

As for unreleased songs, who knows what is left, and what is available. I can remember reading of the hard time they had in tracing the original master tapes of the official recordings at the time of the ABKO remasters. One can just imagine the unreleased stuff.

Ticket prices. 90/100 euro was the price I paid in most European venues. I know it was more expensive in the UK, but life IS more expensive in the UK!!! The average price for a live concert of any new big act in Italy would be 60/70. AC/DC (not a new act, but the latest example at hand, was 70!)

Football / Stones. My point is that if one can spend 150 euros to see Milan Inter every year, he can find 100 for the stones if he wants. It's all entertainment after all!

C

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T&A

ok - well, i don't think their attitude has much to do with the viability of the bootleg market, frankly. and, there's been a very noticeable change in the number of "leaks" of boards the past decade or so - that might be a better indicator of how "tolerant" the lads are, actually....

Don't forget that there are more and more people and interests involved. Record sessions today are no longer as naive as they used to be. No matter what you think, if the Stones were against bootlegs, I know a couple of sites that would have had problems by now ...

C

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liddas

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T&A

ok - well, i don't think their attitude has much to do with the viability of the bootleg market, frankly. and, there's been a very noticeable change in the number of "leaks" of boards the past decade or so - that might be a better indicator of how "tolerant" the lads are, actually....

Don't forget that there are more and more people and interests involved. Record sessions today are no longer as naive as they used to be. No matter what you think, if the Stones were against bootlegs, I know a couple of sites that would have had problems by now ...

C

i'm not saying they are "against" them, per se - but their attitude and toleration hardly sets them apart from 99% of the other mainstream acts out there...

Well, I mentioned in another thread dealing with the Stones vaults topic that "in a way, they vaults are already open". If willingly or unwillingly can be discussed, but I am sure that we have the cream of the outtakes already and perfect or near perfect live recordings from almost each and every tour.

I dont quite believe in the "tip of the iceberg" theory like Gazza, though. Given the very natur of their working method, I doubt that the vaults contain many more finished studio tracks, with the possible exception of the 60s when they recorded basically live in the studio. But when an increasing number of tracks on multitrack tapes and machines became available, it was possible to record basic tracks only, and basic guide lead vocal tracks with unfinished melodies and/or lyrics - to be replaced later with finished vocals.

This changed their working method in the studio considerably, and in a way it made them lazier. Remember that Kimsey stated that when he prepared Tattoo You, all the song scetches - dating back to the GHS sessions - were instrumentally more or less already complete, but the one thing they had in common was that all tracks lacked finished lead vocals- thats why Jagger did these vocal overdub sessions - he had to write melodies, lyrics and record new, final vocals.

I simply believe that apart from the ABKCO era, there is not much in the vaults in terms of finished recordings of unreleased songs, at least not much that we dont know and have already, like Drift Away, We Had It All and so on.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-03-24 22:35 by alimente.

There is plenty of material they could release from the vaults (IF they are willing to do so) B-sides for starters, alternate versions (for almost every song post 71 there are alternate versions, outtakes, long versions, you name it) I would love to have officially released versions from say Living In The Heart Of Love in excellent quality (who doesn't?).

What is beyond belief for me is that Universal (a major company with numerous signed artists and bands getting deluxe treatments on cd) is so quiet in the fact that they signed the rolling stones (THE ROLLING STONES!!) and not a word from them concerning a marketing campaign for the back-catalogue. I would have guessed they are proud to have this group in their stall, but not a word..

Now I hear rumors that it is being quietly released with nothing extra, so the only difference between these new versions and the Virgin versions will be the name Universal??
And maybe (just maybe) it is being "remastered" (brickwalled?)

I really can't believe this will be it.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2009-03-25 19:07 by barbabang.

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alimente

I dont quite believe in the "tip of the iceberg" theory like Gazza, though. Given the very natur of their working method, I doubt that the vaults contain many more finished studio tracks, with the possible exception of the 60s when they recorded basically live in the studio. .

I didnt suggest there were and I agree with what you've suggested about the way they record. I would however imagine there would be sufficient unreleased takes - even if they are alternate versions of released songs - to fill 20 minutes or more on each CD.

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JumpingKentFlash
Hey thanks. Didn't see that, or then I forgot.
Who is this Yazid dude? Anybody know? He's awfully quiet, and only posts a few times.

Yazid mentioned a few pages back that he works for Universal in France, Kent.

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Yazid Manou

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Yazid Manou
Most of the releases should be out on may, june and july.

You did not need me to get the list but here it is anyway :

MAY
Sticky Fingers
Goats Head Soup
It's Only Rock 'N' Roll
Black And Blue

JUNE
Some Girls
Emotional Rescue
Tattoo You
Undercover

JULY
Dirty Work
Steel Wheels
Voodoo Lounge
Bridges To Babylon
A Bigger Bang

OCTOBER
Exile On Main Street

YM

Yazid,do you know anything about the remastering of A Bigger Bang ?
It´s less than four years since it was released,so which technical
improvements are to expected in this special case ?
If it´s going to be released without the two tracks of the special edition
one could speak more of a downgrade concerning this one.

As your list contains no live albums or samplers will they get a seperate
treatment later or will they be just kicked in the bin ?

Funny that Exile is gonna be out last. Like THAT makes any sense.

Just what is UMe anyway?

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skipstone
Funny that Exile is gonna be out last. Like THAT makes any sense.

Just what is UMe anyway?

UMe ???
Must be Universal Music Entertainment,...,they should hope it doesn´t change into
UMd...

Exile in October could ( if the whole is true ) be an attempt to stretch it
for Xmas,but no,without ANY new or added material that´s nonsense,
I DON`T KNOW,the whole seems completely senseless so far.
REMASTERED,come on - for the &$%%% time the whole ----- NO !

Limited by sales...only !

why on earth would anyone buy this unless they dont already have the cds already? just a ridiculous waste of time

A slightly OT question RE "the Vaults".
Did the Voodoo Brew/Stew/Residue, the "Satanic Sessions" 8 cds and the Acetates/Static In The Attic titles stem from the same leak?

They had in common to be perfect DAT clones of the Stones own master tapes?
TOO bad the well's dry now...

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JumpingKentFlash
2.- Do they have extra stuff on them?

Exile on Main Street will be delivered with a bonus. That's all I know for now. We wait for more informations from the international marketing dept.

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JumpingKentFlash
3.- Will they be released as digipacks or will it be standard jewel cases?

Standard jewel cases.

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JumpingKentFlash
Who is this Yazid dude? Anybody know? He's awfully quiet, and only posts a few times.

I'm not a Stones expert. I'm a freelance publicist hired by Universal Music FRANCE. I only post when I think I have interesting things to say.

YM



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-03-25 03:46 by Yazid Manou.

Jewels are better than digi-paks.

Exile with extras? That's interesting. Considering how they used leftover Fingers tunes for that LP.

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skipstone
Jewels are better than digi-paks.

Exile with extras? That's interesting. Considering how they used leftover Fingers tunes for that LP.

Boxes see: [www.superjewelbox.com]

And Exile extras? Perhaps some Jagger on piano, some picture shows, some Robert Frank documentaries ... ?

There should be enough to release some extra DVD ... ;-)

Yazid is a great man.
If you have any question about Jimi Hendrix, he's definitely the guy you got to ask.

I'm sure he will give all the info as soon as the record company itself will let him know.

[doctorstonesblog.blogspot.com]

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Doc
Yazid is a great man.
If you have any question about Jimi Hendrix, he's definitely the guy you got to ask.

I'm sure he will give all the info as soon as the record company itself will let him know.

Well, this is going slighly OT, but if Yazid could help, it would be great!

A friend of mine claims that he once had an American version of the Are You Experienced LP with the alternative version of Red House (echoed guitar) on it. If so, there should be an American release with the UK set of songs. True or is he day dreaming?

C

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T&A


i'm not saying they are "against" them, per se - but their attitude and toleration hardly sets them apart from 99% of the other mainstream acts out there...

I wouldn't say that 99% is the appropriate figure, but still, the stones are not with the 1% "sharks", as one would imagine arguing from all these posts that picture them as greedy bastards

But my point was different. Consider Dylan's bootleg series or Pearl Jam live releases of every given show of their latest tours. IF the stones had done something similar (to profit also in this field) you bet that Virgin then and Universal now (the owners of the copyright) would not be so happy to see that the same stuff they are selling circulates for free on the net (or, even worse, is sold by boot labels) Besides the Stones have always been reluctant in releasing material that THEY believed was not along their standards (think of Jamming with Edward).

C

C

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dcba
A slightly OT question RE "the Vaults".
Did the Voodoo Brew/Stew/Residue, the "Satanic Sessions" 8 cds and the Acetates/Static In The Attic titles stem from the same leak?

They had in common to be perfect DAT clones of the Stones own master tapes?
TOO bad the well's dry now...

Dont know about "Voodoo Residue", but Ronnie's stepson was apparently the source for the other VL sessions.

Oddly enough, Ronnie himself was the source for the original tape of Dirty Work outtakes which first circulated in early 1987. So I was informed anyway at the time by the trader who sent me a low-gen tape and was able to account for the lineage.

Exile on Main Street will be delivered with a bonus.



Itty bitty replicas of the postcards?

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tatters
Exile on Main Street will be delivered with a bonus.



Itty bitty replicas of the postcards?

It would be nice (understatement)if Universal came with a press statement regarding the reissues.
It's a bit strange that we have to hear any news on this from a second hand source (unofficial) in France rather, than an official source from Universal. Don't they have a pr and marketing department?

Record companies are selling less records than previousluy, in case you didn't notice. Therefore they lowered their effectives and hire PR's when they need some, instead of having to pay them all-year-long.

[doctorstonesblog.blogspot.com]

yes I did notice that less record are being sold, but come on! Still enough for the major labels. If there is a major release coming in May, there has to be some kind of reports coming from Universal. It doesnt come out of nowhere.

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barbabang
yes I did notice that less record are being sold, but come on! Still enough for the major labels. If there is a major release coming in May, there has to be some kind of reports coming from Universal. It doesnt come out of nowhere.

I kindda like that we're considered good enough to know about this before anyone else. It's kindda cool and gives us a sense that we're more important than the public riff-raff peasants.

JumpingKentFlash

...And thanks to Yazid and Gazza for great answers.

JumpingKentFlash

"Ronnie's stepson was apparently the source for the other VL sessions"

Talk about an insider... LOL!
Did Keith manage to have Junior's legs broken?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-03-25 16:29 by dcba.

I don't like those superjewel cases.

Eh, at least give us all of the B-sides on one album. That would be good. As far as a realistic extra. It's a start.

And why not a disc of the (good) remixes? I wish that would happen.

What label is it that is now doing a make your own CD? I saw that on Google News somewhere.

Maybe they'll have this tongue on the proper albums?

Oops.





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-03-25 16:38 by skipstone.

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tatters
Exile on Main Street will be delivered with a bonus.



Itty bitty replicas of the postcards?

Dont know about those postcards, but my source told me that it will be a DVD with live cuts from 1972 "and/or" the Montreux tour rehearsals. Concerning the live material, there is no information available YET if its a compilation of cuts from either L&G and CS Blues or both. At this moment, any guesses that its one of the movies in its entirety are just that - guesses. According to my source, the last thing he has heard about this is that there are still "contractual matters" to be sorted out, thats why Exile is postponed to October.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2009-03-25 19:20 by alimente.